5 years of failure (Entrepreneurship) AMA
I have been on this journey for a long time now. Lots of failure comes with loads of learning. Each step or initiative I took has helped me grow as a person, the business guy (ed-tech, media space), and also in terms of technicalities (full-stack product management, hardcore hands-on into technology and I love user experience) Ps: currently running an edtech startup in pre-seed/seed stage Feel free to ask anything, would be happy to help even personally
How to land a job at a start up ? They start ups are for learning of generalists but deep down they want experience in the business such hypocrisy . Also why only tech colleges and experiences. In the same a person doing liberal arts ends up working in a tech start up but in India they only give chances to tech people
referral. in today’s market, if you don’t have a good pedigree, the only hope is referral. believe it or not, luck is a big aspect in landing a role as a fresher in startup today
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
hey, this is a most common question, especially from people of non-technical background.
Startups are fragile and got to move fast, depending upon the stage (pre-seed to A+) are in need of domain specialists. Generalists or business experience is a myth until you are joining in as a co-founder.
The lesser the team size the more the specialists are required. I won't look for an employee with business/marketing skills (for example) if I am hiring for a full-stack developer. I just want the employee to execute tech for me faster.
So how do you get in?
1. PROVE, with the projects or your personal brand, remember your work and activity builds trust, that's the only thing for a startup to make decision earlyon (you may also do internships at multiple startups of same domain, say fintech)
2. PASSIONATE, startups look for people who love what they do and not looking just for a job
3. CULTURE-FIT, startups are highly demanding in terms of work, they check if you have a mindset to hustle and is a doer (most important)
4. KNOWLEDGE, study the startup, their business and competitors, and also look at the startup ecosystem in-general (this is a hack to impress that says you understand business from outside and you are passionate about startups)
Hope this helps, it's a competitive market, dont be ordinary, try standing out and showcase work proudly.
I picked up Product management to help me get a better idea of different facets of building a product/business. Do you think PMing can help prepare for entrepreneurship?
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
You are on the right path,
Also make sure you don't dodge the development part, when you closely collaborate with developers it's a chance for you to understand technical building blocks and challenges of a product because it's good to have knowledge when you are essentially building tech startup.
but do remember PM creates a product mindset but not necessarily an entrepreneur mindset. There's a thin line between both. So, keep seeking inspiration from all over the world, join online communities, follow startup news and connect/follow with VCs/founders on LinkedIn.
I moved from engineering and built products at quite a scale. So, I’m quite covered in that aspect.
I fear the product mindset thing might be correct. Anything I should do to get closer to entrepreneurship mindset? What is it even?
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What prompted you to do Ed tech startup when Byju and Unacademy exists? Curious to what drives individual who believe they can disrupt an existing highly VC backed ecosystem.
Especially considering that there's not much money out there for funding UA like the current biggies did it
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
Brilliant question!
You know there's one thing that goes in the business world especially the startup ecosystem,
One builds, multiple follows, everyone is just running a race to grab the market share with a different flavour in terms of TG or biz model. The recent disruption in ed-tech was upskilling, in 2019-20 we were the early players of it as well (we shutdown in covid since we started with physical training and distribution) and everyone talked with recently limits the conversation till upskill market only. Why not think beyond? The education sector is a limitless opportunity, multiple loopholes and you can surely come up with solutions beyond upskilling if you think more.
Regarding investments, there's always money available that can be raised, yes it has slowed down and Ed-tech is cold right now. But numbers are everything, if you are able to make money and show traction (early signs of demand or early pmf) you are good to go.
We love and are passionate about Ed-tech, upskill was an eye opener for us, so we are onto our next journey.
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Pirate_metrics
Stealth
a year ago
How are your dealing with CAC in your current Edtech company?
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
We prefer not to sell courses directly in this highly saturated market. It's just not worth to burn on those conversion campaigns. Instead try a combination of campaigns+free content/tools which can assist user in the context needed.
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
this will lead to brand awareness and getting to know their needs at the same time, iterate the audience variable and source until you find the right distribution.
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
problem > solution > identify set of target users > build > identify KPIs > distribute to target users > get feedback > iterate > keep narrowing target users till you find your ideal user who is willing to pay or is your fan
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Are you edtech or just another examtech , tution tech startup like vedantu and all other loss making... eventually I found that edtech can't make much money everyone wants to do the same thing... online coaching for UPSC ssc and all other exams..
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
No, we are operating in a new vertical and not the usual upskill or entrance prep.
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
and yes we were bored too with the saturated Ed-tech market, so we didn't resume the upskill initiative of ours back from 2019
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BoogieMan
Stealth
a year ago
Why do you think EdTech is crumbling in India? I have my own opinions about this, but I would love to hear from you in this anon environment where you could speak out even politically incorrect stuff about the sector.
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
Ed-tech is suffering due to two reasons: primary being other sectors taking over (Generative AI, fintech, climate tech) and Failure of Byjus (they went on an acquisition spree and things went south)
This all is just temporary, a bump, so we need not worry much. Education is always a booming sector since it is basic need sortof.
Agree .. this is temporary , and most of the comments and elsewhere is that Ed Tech has no future .. I believe it is just different models being tried in volatile situations( pre covid ..Covid and post covid ) .. Cannot write of ed tech due to current scenario .
Qwerty2398
Stealth
a year ago
Really? Another edtech?.
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
Haha yes, but Ed-tech is not synonymous to upskill or marketplace, there are many opportunities out there, you need to look deeper and identify problems.
MaddDogg
Stealth
a year ago
How much did you make, was your business profitable(at some point)? If so, what went wrong?
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
We cracked our distribution channel early-on (source of user acquisition), and upskill vertical in edtech was just getting started, hence we hit profitability within the first cohort itself (we were cohort based upskilling model)
We hit 1cr revenue within 2 cohort and then the Covid hit. Since our distribution (we used to conduct an entrance test to filter candidates) and training both were physically done, we hit a speedbreaker and hence had to transition online within next few months, since we were bootstrapped we couldn't survive due to heavy cash burn and had to shut it down.
Very similar experience
This is my third startup, been two years now with this one and still in the early stages.
The first two were full of learning and got an understanding on what not to do.
Happy to see people from similar backgrounds 😊.
All the best 😊
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
Good to hear from a fellow entrepreneur always, wish you the best my friend 📈💪
How do you validate your own assumption that customers are going to love your product/startup and find it valuable
I find that in some of the sectors, wleven to validate this basic assumption, a lot of capital and work is needed (I wanted to create lovable toys and stationary)
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
I have posted in one of the comments on how to validate. To answer your high capital need specifically, it completely depends upon the nature of business, but considering your idea, it should happen within a few lakhs till you validate. Go step-by-step, talk with vendors for pricing and then you will get better idea about it.
But you can always hack capital through pre-orders 👌
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
also, I need not say, but factor in marketing, logistics etc.. my very advice would be to go lean as possible, find hacks at each level to save costs.
@WrySpace18 just went through the answers. Such great insights and honesty!
Thanks for doing this, and hope the current startup aces it :)
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
Thank you, I love how friendly and pumped people are here on Grapevine 😀
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
Your Solution <> Constant revenue with YoY % increase <> Identified user market
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
Unfortunately, startups are uncertain, you never know what the future holds.
but, over the years and from learnings, I have realised you can increase the winning probability through some logical parameters (problem, market size, timing etc)
So for me it's the problem and the scale is affecting individuals right now and hence market size.
No idea is a moonshot bydefault, it's a step-by-step process and multiple iterations. We are currently validating our thesis by offering our product to users and iterating accordingly.
Let's see 🙈
RandomMess
Stealth
a year ago
I am getting an opportunity to work at an early age startup backed by huge VCs, on the other hand I also have an offer from one of the unicorns. There are really no direct cons, in the early age wala startup I ll actually get the knowledge of how the whole thing actually works, and learning would be immense but I think the unicorn wala startup work would be more challenging as will have to keep up with their current ways. Also is it safe to bet on an early age startup which you kind of has this intuition that its gonna boom 9/10.
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
You seem to be more aligned towards early stage one. Do what your heart says at this point. It's great if you are excited and able to connect with the vision of the early stage startup, that's your fuel to work hard and happily there daily :)
RandomMess
Stealth
a year ago
I have been working in a similar kind of situation but in a different industry. I am really confused between challenging work that would definitely boost my domain knowledge vs all the knowledge i could gain from working at an early age fintech.
I am on verge of quitting the job and start something own. There are multiple ideas which I have but confused with what to start?
Not into creating world class startups, more into traditional dhandha with digital and branding touch.
How to find the right reason to quite and just jump in?
PS - Saving are limited so looking for quick wins.
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
Rule 1. don't quit to build if you are a first-time entrepreneur (because people who have failed previously and multiple times know very well what it takes)
You think it takes X money and X time to build something and X time to breakeven or be profitable, but in reality it won't match or maybe far from expectations.
Build slowly steadily with a job> get some paying users > scale a little > match your salary/raise external money > quit to pursue full-time
Don't be afraid or sad to work long hours along with a job (make little progress daily)
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
and THERE ARE NO QUICK WINS or MONEY in entrepreneurship or business be it traditional or tech based
It will take up investment, time and insane energy.
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why still persist on edtech, given the incumbents also going offline and now not much education left in the sector?
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
I am not clear about "not much education left", can you elaborate on this fact of yours
from my understanding largest user group in India is jinko "paper nikalna hai" or pretend same.
Coming form limited personal experience as student
The larger ones are nothing more than lms + live entertainment/blabbering maximum non hero educators are not Teacher more like Youtuber/young chap can't explain single out of line query. No standardised base line,
I had also interviewed with lido learning they had higher bar to hire business development folks than teacher any bachelor degree can go and teach. Eventually it went down.
In gross generalization I'd say edtech company main objective is to get enrollments be it by selling hopes or misinformed emis their sales guys are directed to keep aside any ethics and sell to anyone. No thought given to what to teach how to teach who will teach.
Inse jyada imaan dharam toh mere town ka local airhostess training institute wala ka hai moti aur low height ladki dekh kar boldeta hai madam aapka mushkil se hi hopaega dekhlo,
Now be this non woke- whatever ist thing to do it's atleast in sync with actual world happenings. Doesn't mis-sell fake promises.
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SharpOmelet
Stealth
a year ago
What the hell is full-stack product management?
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
ummm just a general product manager, pardon for the typo, there's no edit in gv 🫠
I am APM but my team calls me full stack product manager because I take up development tasks too if need arises.
Have a past experience as developer so able to do basic things like integrating APIs and writing CRUD operations to speed up development and meet timelines.
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1. Is tech an important skills if we looking for a generalist role in edtech or any seed stage startup?
2. How are you making sure CAC is low and cream leads are generated (provided marketing expenses have decreased for major edtechs, especially after 2020)
3. What marketing automation tool you think would be better to use in current market?
4. Any idea on how can I access free resources or reports on edtech. I am new to edtech space.
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
1. I am not clear about what a generalist role means here, if you can elaborate more
2. CAC is always a challenge, as mentioned in one of the comments, dont directly sell the course but build some free content or tools around it and then engage via campaign
3. Basic marketing stack, nothing fancy, MS clarity for session recordings/heatmaps, GA for analytics/funnel, WA automation for transactional messages (rest CRM and everything custom built on our end)
4. You wont get reports at a single place, it's all scattered, you may do some right keywords searches to suit your needs, there's a lot available and I have bookmarked many in the last few months i dont even remember now haha
All the best. Edtech has a lot of potential and is needed as well, and we need folks addressing genuine problems. Curious about which specific problem area you are addressing provided you are comfortable sharing that.
WrySpace18
Stealth
a year ago
Hey, thank you.
And yes it's high time problems need to be addressed at the core to fix the broken system.
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