Thoughts on staying in a luxury hotel, and income tax crossing corporate tax...
Writing this from the lobby of a good hotel in the city There are 3 types of people I see around me: 1. Foreigners (50%): Mostly on business travel. From various countries. Their economies and companies can afford to pay for this, it's nothing. Some with family, so maybe just traveling India in a luxury way. 2. People like me (20%): Indian corporate folks. Working at consulting/VC/MNCs etc. My company pays for this. But there's a deep cost. I work 12-14 hour days. I don't enjoy the hotel as much. We are pretty much slaves, by choice. 3. Indian business folk (30%): The thieves. They expense all of this to their business. Every expense to them is at a discount, because they can use it to show losses on their books, and get away with tax. They live better lives than us. We are not them. Income tax crossing corporate tax data point really struck with me. Governments have started giving more freebies. We enjoy fewer public facilities. The only reason to be in India is that I love the friends and family here. But otherwise, as a salaried employee (as we all are), we should know that we're kind of being duped.
LooseGoose
Stealth
23 days ago
It's a bit too much calling business owners thieves bro. Your hotel stay is paid for by a business too. That's risk and reward, plain and simple.
Besides, MSMEs in India hardly earn much in the first place to be able to pay a lot of tax. It's the top percentile that gets away with waivers of crores, while business owners like me can't even get an uncollateralized loan at a decent interest rate.
Not all of them, but many of them are
The kind of businesses we are in, that fund our trips, do not show expenses to show losses. These are two very different types of businesses.
Sure, MSMEs in India that don't earn much, should not pay much taxes. Salaried employees in India, who don't earn much, should also not pay much taxes. But they do. Because it's easier to take from them.
I know of people much richer than my entire family who pay a fraction of the taxes I do, and pay in cash whenever they can.
Risk and reward? That's not related to the point I'm trying to make.
But I will add
Just because the kind of companies we work in aren't incentivized to hide expenses for lower taxes... many do follow shady practices at some level.
Even the big ones.
As an employee, you cannot.
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DaringTrain
Stealth
23 days ago
The bigger thieves are the bureaucrats - A class you forgot to include and would account for double digit % of the rooms booked.
They stay at taxpayer's expense, they get all sorts of luxuries and then they also don't do their jobs honestly. They are the system, and there's no way they can be weeded out unless they screw up in a massive way.
You missed the startup folks (founders, senior leadership). They also occupy five star rooms. They are also businesses that show losses and live better lives than corporates. They do it on VC money, so no one cares. But their wastage ensures that such hotels can keep prices artifically inflated.
Also, on your point #2. Corporate folks, especially those working at consulting companies. A large portion (double digit %) of their revenues are also government contracts. So, it's us taxpayers who are paying for consultants to live in five stars and give advice that has zero practical value. Yes they work 12-14 hours a day, but that doesn't justify why we bear such costs.
Bureaucrats yes. And their kin. Very true.
Startup folks - tbh, they begin staying at good hotels only at a very advanced stage. So they are in the minority (only so many Series C/D+ startups). Startup folks aren't even 5% of these hotels.
Wait till you stay at some postcard / six senses / raffles / "luxury leisure resorts category" property, this anecdote of yours would fall flat, what you've observed only holds true for "business hotels" in cities.
Indians are happily splurging on rooms costing upwards of 30k nightly, albeit it might be one off event for some of the guests.
Stayed across most of these
The only change at the ones you mentioned: 70% business folks, 30% employees (funded by companies for offsite, or getting married or something like that)
Indians are splurging on rooms (even salaried class), but it's 3-4 nights a year for us, even for the ones who can afford a lot
DaringTrain
Stealth
22 days ago
I just checked six senses
Who is paying 50k a night?
Is it worth it?
Isme to iPhone Aa jayega
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Calling business folks as thieves is BS, if you have easy loopholes as a salaried person to save taxes. I'm pretty sure you'll use it.
Don't hate the player, blame the game. If the govt wants they definitely can bring stricter laws for biz owners but that's also a very big chuck of their vote bank so no ruling govt will gonna do it it's a slow process.
Tax saving isn’t the same as tax avoidance
You don’t really have such extreme tools at the disposal of salaried folk
True, the government isn’t incentivized. “Dont hate the player, hate the game” is spot on. It’s just what you see immediately around you.
I know business people who obsessively keep every receipt, even from eating an omelette at a dhaba, because they can bill it as a company expense.
Thanks for sharing man. I agree the businessmen are crooks and have stolen too much money from regulars like us
I say it's good that individual tax rates crossed corporate tax, it means people's earnings have increased,
But what I've found unfair is the treatment these tax payers get, no subsidies because we're not poor in government view, no ROI on all the taxes paid like human beings get in other countries,
Your entire family may be killed by a truck tomorrow and some powerful politician can suppress the news, no wonder every one who can leave is leaving India, the so called brain drain,
All these aside just the ROI aspect is antagonising our nation for some time now,
What we need is a reservation system for tax payers in all public aspects like government sponsered taxpayers only schools colleges hospitals with 5 star standards like some of our airports, and the subsidy you get should be linked to your tax bracket, more tax you pay more subsidy you get, this would help India onboard a lot more hidden rustoms who want to avoid tax because they'd rather hide that money as black and spend rest of their lives handling shady money vs paying tax like they should
It's a business bro where you are employed!!!
Stop abusing Indian businesses.
Only because of the business ecosystem a country grows and prospers.
Yes there are bad people in business, so in every other field.
A system which produces goods and services while employing people and earning profit as by product is a business.
Go to LinkedIn..namo and nirmala has posted something...here it's useless rant
Incorrect/clouded observations. FIT (non biz folks) drive most occ for lux-upper upscale resort, if you dig into reports of hotel firms & otas u d be surprised that corporate bookings constitutes fairly less % as it seems at first glance. I felt same as you too when used to travel to new city every other day, only until now when started in hospitality sector i see details
Just a different take on business folk. You can read about why business folks are supported and given tax relief by every country. This is mostly because they are job providers. Another thing is they always pump their profit again back to market to expand their business. It is not always perfect, but this works for now. That's why it is like it is. It is a hard pill to swallow.
Mentioning a "people like me" category, which gets a pass due to the work hours, is some crazy rationalization.
There are plenty of people like you who are lazy, and there are plenty of Indian business folk who work really hard. Moreover, businesses face existential threats every so often, in the form of a bad season, a tech disruptor, running out of favor with a decision maker at the buyer end, and so on. The existential threat that a jobber faces is loosing that job, and waiting for a few months to find a new job.
Stop the pity party. "A slave by choice" is nonsensical English, the meaning of the word slave implies a lack of choice.
Freebies aren't the major Expenditure of this government, loan waivers to large corporates are the biggest expenditure of this government. If these loan waivers can be stopped, the government will save a lot.
One way to look at it, without emotions is that businesses pay all the tax. You don't pay anything. Your income tax is just GST on human labour that your company is paying. Why do you even think about how much is the TDS. If you start paying tax for your maid say 2,000 rs extra on her salary of 6,000 rs - would she care ? No right, then why do you care so much about that number
