PM doesn't have authority over any other function than their own team. They aren't manager of techies, designers or business people they work with. They can at most influence to work on their project but can't dedicate what you do .

Software Engineer

Those with God complex won't go for as PM on his/her can't do much. If Devs, designers , analysts don't trust them it would be hard to deliver a good product.

Would you report to a pm in a software company if the pm has half the amount or lesser work experience than you, none in your field but is a pm and pm's must be mini ceo's!

Welcome to Office Gossip's Private Community

Does being a Product Manager mean you by default must have reportees of all functions?

Product Owner

Does being a Product Manager mean you by default must have reportees of all functions?- Grapevine

Coding is like solving 2+2 but coders take pride in the fact that you do it in English but I can do it in Sanskrit.Iykwim. I have coded for two years and as long as you're well versed in a language it's like making simple additions and subtractions in that language. Still coders make mistakes because they're lazy and incompetent like the rest of us . 80 percentage of coders just solve basics and still act like it's a big deal . Product Managers are not special I get it but coders are not special too just by knowing a language. It's like a bilingual person shitting on someone who knows just one language. When we all know if you're brought up in a certain way it's very easy to speak in two languages like we all do in India.

Why do people shit on product managers

Product Manager

Welcome to Product Managers's Private Community

When asked at the end of the interview, what questions do you generally ask the interviewers? There can be two types of interviewers, one from the PM org and the other from the engineering org (in later rounds) and usually senior folks. What type of questions can be asked to both types of panels?

PM interviews: What questions do you generally ask interviewers after the interview?

Sharing some reflections on this:

1. Product is not a function with a large hierarchy / multiple levels in the ladder. Managerial responsibility comes in very late in the product career and the spans are typically small (relative to other functions like engineering, sales, operations). This also means a steeper funnel to the top and only a handful VP Product roles in the industry.

2. Product is centered around technology and digital consumer trends, both of which are fast changing. This requires constant unlearning and relearning. But more critically, this also means that previous knowledge/experience hits a plateau on marginal value beyond a basic threshold (where you have developed some essential product semse and skills).

3. Product managers are also much higher-paid vs other functional peers, at comparable years of experience. This means that a PM gets to a very high salary (say, 1+ crore) by the age of 40 (15-20y into their career). Tech functions in non-tech companies (like FMCG, banking) cannot offer that kind of pay, meaning salary growth beyond a point is limited to tech-first companies / limiting addressable market for lateral moves.

All of these considererd, how should PMs think about the longevity of their careers? Unlike traditional roles, this does not seem like a "retire at 60" job. What would be the realistic age one should plan for, at which career growth and salary growth will stagnate? What are ways in which a 80%ile PM can extend their career (eg: also taking up engineering management or P&L responsibility or growth function etc., to increase scope)?

PS: this post is not for the top 5-10% PMs. They will always find roles at VP level etc, this is for the 50-90%ile bucket of PM talent.

Longevity of a product career

Will commend you on a very well written and well articulated post. 
  
 Options for the future will be apparent at ~40.  Most peak roles will be achieved between 45-50. 
  
 Possible exits: 
  
 1. Running Category roles at companies which have a broad canvas, multiple product categories. 
 2. Deputing for and eventually running a P&L or a LoB. 
 3. Sales or more critically Customer Success.  Don't shy away from revenue responsibilities. 
  
 Engineering is a sharp left turn imo.  It's not an overlapping skillset at best and don't see how that is part of a PMs likely roadmap.

Sales Manager

Investor

I am reading very often that the craze around product management is too much and this career is not worth the hype. Adding on to that it has huge supply of PMs and many of PMs are underpaid. Is it true?

Is product management as career reallyworth the hype?

Intern

Note - I am a product manager too

4 out of 5 product managers will act all high and mighty of themselves, bragging their way as if they run everything going on in the company, flaunting their business degrees and being utterly disrespectful towards their team( dev design qa name it), 

Recently started going to office so the attitude I am seeing is very transparent and more visible (more with the higher experience folks)

It makes me wanna leave this hyper inflated role, thinking of I will end up like them scares me, and you have to do is speak out jargons in meetings day in day out and have a English accent of Shashi Tharoor.

Recently my manager told that this is a role where you have to very representable or very visible and act in floor as if you are the busiest person on earth and I seriously some PMs in company doing that, they walk so fast in floor as if they will fall off or would be better to have 4 legs.

I am done with this product management shit

I believe that PM roles require much more experience in understanding the product rather than making product teardown as projects which literally anyone can do. I don't see a real skill involved, it's like a person who is a consultant but being overpaid because he is too much involved in the product. It's the startup culture which started. I think Project/product manager roles should be a promotional mark for experienced software developers or analysts.

Do you think PM roles should be there for freshers?

How does the market demand for product managers in the short term? Do you guys see any reduced demand for the role? Difficult to find any openings or difficulty in clearing the interviews?

How true is this?

With the recent influx of talent who are trying to enter the world of PMing just because they overheard that PMs are CEO of the product, and they get paid really well, the bar throughout the industry is decreasing. 

While we need more PMs, I feel most of the 2-3yoe PMs i'm meeting either for interview or guidance are more like COGS in the wheel. They are doing more and more of Program Management. Any PM at any level should spend atleast 10-20% of their time thinking about product vision, and how will the world look like if their product succeeds in 1y). 

We need folks like Anuj, and other senior veterans, to come up and train the middle management of most of the companies to really improve PMing as a function in India

Future of PMing in India

Software Developer

Welcome to Indian Startups's Private Community

Consultant, Investment Banking went from sought after careers to fads post 2008 crisis when the world realized that these folks are crooks due to their role in propogating the Great Financial Crisis.

Given the backlash tech companies has been getting and global layoffs, will Product Manager also become a passing fad?

Seeing lot of anti Product Manager sentiment on this app off late. Was Product Management also a fad?

Someone here said engineers can become PM but PM can't become engineers. It can't be more correct than this. But reality is, it sounds goods only in theory.  
  
  I asked this same question to my director, why have you hired us when engineers clearly know more about products than us and are capable?  His answered that before the organisation formally created a team of product managers, it was only engineers that were handling product for decades. But that resulted into substandard products being developed, chaotic product release and consistent drop in revenue. The reason being engineers became backlog managers and engineers beging engineers, never focused on business value. Instead, they focused on technical aspect heavily. Engineers never bothered to check if what they were developing will actually sell in the market or not.  
  
 And mind you, this was a product that all of us use in daily lives. The numbers of users in India alone would be millions. So to summarise, yes, engineers can become PMs but generally they stay loyal to their pedigree of BE/B.Tech and become very shitty PMs. They like to have more technical conversations than strategic discussions and hate things that are not quantifiable, subjective. And business facing people here in forum would know, things are always not quantifiable in business planning, market outlook. It is based on assumptions.  
  
 An excellent PM would be someone who is an engineer but knows how to focus on business value of the product, make it customer oriented etc. I had the pleasure of working of one such PM in my last stint and he was truly outstanding. CEO knew him personally and this is in an organization with thousands of employees

Program Manager

So I've met many PMs in my career. Most have been sub par, poor performers, can't even do IC work. The ones who can do IC work, can't think. The IC work is generally project management not product. They need someone to tell them directions

So here's a few things. The best PMs I've met, are good engineers. Yes. These are the same folks who come for product management conferences and are respected. 
Of course not all engineers are good at product.
The role of product came up with manufacturing first when you had product designers who worked with engineers and had a good understanding of both engineering limitations and user understanding. 

Some of the PMs I have met don't even talk to users. The reason i am seeing an issue in PMs in India is the increase in demand in the role, and a lack of supply.

There is a product engineer role, I met a few folks who are doing that, they were amazing. Knew technology, users, product and super passionate.

I'm not saying this is a hard and fast rule, I'm sure there are folks who have a natural inclination, so if you're an exception, understand that. Don't get offended by the statement

What PMs lack in India

Founder’s Office

Transitioning to an SPM role (IC for now) in a new org soon and wanted some advice from the ones who’ve been there and done that (SPMs, VPs, Directors)

What are some absolute must-do things in the first 3 months to set the groundwork for success?

What are some common pitfalls to avoid?

Any good resources that helped you, please share :)

Advice from Product Leaders

I want to break into product management. I am an ML engineer with 4 yrs of experience in service based companies. What job roles should I apply to and how should I go on preparing for it?

What PM roles should I apply?

Data Scientist

Welcome to Software Engineers's Private Community

Do you think pure product managers with no technical background add value to your company? Aren't experienced project managers with penchant for business more suitable for this role?

Do you think product managers with barely 2 years of experience required in your company?

Analyst

What is with the impatience and not wanting to listen to people under you and assert unnecessary dominance?

Non Tech PMs should have patience and understanding or not be in the role

Data engineer

I have been lately curious about the two PMs (Product Manager vs Program Manager).
If anyone can help with answer to these questions that would be great

Does your company have both roles?
If yes, are salaries for both on par.
If not, who gets more salary

Does being a Product Manager mean you by default must have reportees of all functions?

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